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Translators' noticeboard
Translators' noticeboard

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Oldest pages needing changes marked for translation (June/July 2024)

[edit]
Latest comment: 2 days ago11 comments7 people in discussion

Per Aafi's comment above, below is a list of the oldest pages with pending changes that need to be marked for translation, starting from June to July 2024.

  1. Commons:Copyright rules by territory/Niger, since 06 June 2024
  2. Commons:Copyright rules by territory/Federated States of Micronesia, since 09 June 2024
  3. Commons:Copyright rules by territory/Uruguay, since 10 June 2024
  4. Commons:Copyright rules by territory/Yemen (no transclusion support), since 10 June 2024
  5. Commons:Picasa Web Albums files (no transclusion support), since 10 June 2024
  6. Commons:Wiki Loves Earth 2024 in Lebanon, since 14 June 2024
  7. Commons:Wiki Loves Earth 2024 in Palestine, since 14 June 2024
  8. Commons:Wiki Loves Earth 2024 in Syria, since 14 June 2024
  9. Commons:SPARQL query service/queries/examples, since 16 June 2024
  10. Commons:Moving files to Commons, since 17 June 2024
  11. Commons:Upload tools, since 17 June 2024
  12. Commons:Wiki Loves Earth 2024 in Jordan, since 26 June 2024
  13. Commons:Copyright rules by territory/Serbia (no transclusion support), since 29 June 2024
  14. Commons:Guide to layout/Category pages (no transclusion support), since 29 June 2024
  15. Commons:Copyright rules by territory/Italy, since 30 June 2024
  16. Commons:Wiki Loves Monuments 2022/Organizers, since 30 June 2024
  17. Commons:Galleries, since 01 July 2024
  18. Template:Upload campaign header Wiki Loves Earth in Ukraine pre-war pictures warning message/i18n, since 01 July 2024
  19. Commons:Copyright rules by territory/United Arab Emirates, since 02 July 2024
  20. Commons:User-specific galleries, templates and categories, since 02 July 2024
  21. Commons:Wiki Loves Africa 2024/Countries, since 08 July 2024
  22. Commons:Wiki Loves Earth in Albania & Kosovo 2024/Winners, since 11 July 2024
  23. Template:Iranian currency/i18n (no transclusion support), since 14 July 2024
  24. Commons:Copyright rules by territory/Hong Kong (no transclusion support), since 15 July 2024
  25. Commons:Free media resources/Map, since 15 July 2024
  26. Commons:Copyright rules by territory/Mauritania, since 16 July 2024
  27. Commons:How to detect copyright violations, since 16 July 2024
  28. Commons:Tribal Culture Photography Competition, since 19 July 2024
  29. Commons:Copyright rules by territory/Portugal (no transclusion support), since 20 July 2024
  30. Commons:Use of gender neutral language, since 22 July 2024
  31. Commons:Wiki Loves Earth/WLE Resources Center, since 25 July 2024
  32. Commons:Non-copyright restrictions, since 27 July 2024
  33. Commons:Copyright rules by territory/Qatar (no transclusion support), since 28 July 2024
  34. Commons:Copyright rules by territory/Senegal, since 30 July 2024
  35. Commons:User access levels, since 31 July 2024

Feel free to edit the comment to cross out any pages after they have been marked. Thanks. Tvpuppy (talk) 00:00, 8 June 2025 (UTC)Reply

Do you really think working with such a list is needed? Most cases only require one click as there are only minor changes often even outside of the translatable part. I would suggest to make a list only for cases where corrections in the translate syntax are needed. GPSLeo (talk) 05:32, 8 June 2025 (UTC)Reply
+1. Pages with minor changes get marked nonetheless. I find it personally tedious to each time visit Special:PageTranslation particularly to check pages with pending changes: so a list like this seems helpful, but those with minor changes shouldn't usually be listed. signed, Aafi (talk) 08:45, 8 June 2025 (UTC)Reply
It would make the long list of pages on Special:PageTranslation smaller. Also, I don't see any downsides of marking a page for translation. Thanks for compiling this list! Prototyperspective (talk) 16:12, 8 June 2025 (UTC)Reply
@Prototyperspective: could you please help revamp this list (as of current) and as GPSLeo suggested in June? signed, Aafi (talk) 06:09, 7 November 2025 (UTC)Reply
I didn't make this list and don't know how it was made (maybe a script or some Commons search with some sorting?). Tvpuppy made it. Tvpuppy, could you recompile it? And could you maybe also describe how you made the list so that others can compile it too and maybe a bot could then run that periodically for a new report page?
  • However, I wonder whether things as they currently are fine – wouldn't it be better if all pages get marked for translation automatically somehow, isn't that possible? There's so many pages with changes waiting to show up. Also the problem I described in the wish mark as solved at m:Community Wishlist/W308 still isn't solved as many such pages in categories haven't yet been marked for translation. I'm thinking of maybe creating another wish about things being automatically marked for translation (e.g. if not reverted for x days) – would there be any issues with this, what do you think? Often if not usually, changes should show up quickly or even need to such as in the case of temporary events like photo competitions. I don't know if there would be an issue with pages getting marked for translation that shouldn't be marked e.g. because only a few spaces were added (if so please explain), but such may be worth getting things to show up on pages much quicker than currently the case. Also it would be nice if you could mark pages with /Header at the end for translation soon.
Prototyperspective (talk) 12:36, 8 November 2025 (UTC)Reply
@Prototyperspective, perfect touch. We could ask @DreamRimmer to run his bot here for that purpose. It could automatically mark pages for translation where a human review isn't needed. signed, Aafi (talk) 16:20, 8 November 2025 (UTC)Reply
Hi :) How can I help you? My bot is currently set to mark pages for translation when there are no differences between the last marked and pending versions. At the moment, there are 37 pages on Commons that meet this condition. DreamRimmer (talk) 17:34, 9 November 2025 (UTC)Reply
@DreamRimmer, thanks for responding. Could you please have your bot do this here i.e, whenever such a page needs to be marked for translation, the bot takes its care. It'd just save our time. We can ask @Krd go grant TA rights for the purpose? ─ Aafī on Mobile (talk) 19:44, 9 November 2025 (UTC)Reply
@Prototyperspective, thanks for the ping. Previously, I complied the list manually (sorting them by date using Excel), but I have just created a SQL query here that will compile the list automatically and available to see by everyone else.
However, the list basically includes almost everything from the "Pages with pending changes" section in Special:PageTranslation, since I'm not familiar with translating work, so I can't determine which pages only have "minor changes", as others have mentioned above.
Also, I agree that it will be very useful if someone (or a bot) can periodically transfer the query result list to Commons with a more useful format (e.g. adding links). Thanks. Tvpuppy (talk) 20:14, 8 November 2025 (UTC)Reply
If the page is identical to the latest marked version (e.g. it was vandalized and then reverted), that could be automatically marked. This is what User:DreamRimmer bot does (on Meta for now). However, if there are any changes, however small they are, they need human review: if the changes affect translatable parts, the translations may or may not need to be invalidated (a simple typo fix doesn’t need invalidation, but a single-character change that changes the meaning does); if they affect non-translatable parts, they may need to be made translatable; people editing the page may have got the syntax wrong, and translation admins have to correct it before marking the page for translation. —Tacsipacsi (talk) 11:03, 9 November 2025 (UTC)Reply

please confirm

[edit]
Latest comment: 2 days ago22 comments7 people in discussion

I have done some migration work on Template:Denkmalgeschütztes Objekt Österreich/i18n (feedback & help is welcome), and I feel that a translationAdmin has to confirm my changes, before I can adopt the language variants. best --Herzi Pinki (talk) 18:57, 20 August 2025 (UTC)Reply

I am not someone who has an extensive knowledge of templates, so probably @Tacsipacsi might be able to deal with this signed, Aafi (talk) 07:54, 21 August 2025 (UTC)Reply
I feel confident with templates. It's only about the embedding of templates in the translation system and maybe how to extract the two new error texts to separate parameters. --Herzi Pinki (talk) 10:53, 21 August 2025 (UTC)Reply
thx OifigeachWMIE, something is missing. Template:Denkmalgeschütztes Objekt Österreich/i18n: Translate this page; This page contains changes which are not marked for translation. How can I mark them for translation / transfer the changes in Template:Denkmalgeschütztes Objekt Österreich/i18n to Template:Denkmalgeschütztes Objekt Österreich/i18n/en etc.? best --Herzi Pinki (talk) 11:07, 27 August 2025 (UTC)Reply
@Herzi Pinki, they unfortunately responded in a wrong thread ;) I have marked the changes for translation. Let me know in case this breaks anything. Marking this as ✓ Done from here. signed, Aafi (talk) 15:03, 27 August 2025 (UTC)Reply
Better. And now I need help, not just support. The translated stuff should call {{Denkmalgeschütztes Objekt Österreich/Id|$1|2=|3=}} unconditionally, but it doesn't. What is wrong here? best --Herzi Pinki (talk) 18:25, 27 August 2025 (UTC) @Aafi: as requested --Herzi Pinki (talk) 18:26, 27 August 2025 (UTC)Reply
@Jarekt, would you be able to look at this? ─ Aafī on Mobile (talk) 18:56, 27 August 2025 (UTC)Reply
I’m not sure how the template works but if you wanted to call {{Denkmalgeschütztes Objekt Österreich/Id|$1|2=|3=}} unconditionally, then you don’t need the if-statement. The current setup means that it is doing “If the result of the Denkmalgeschütztes Objekt Österreich/Id is X, then do Y”, since both X and Y is not specified, it is not doing anything. Tvpuppy (talk) 01:14, 28 August 2025 (UTC)Reply

Please double check the templates above in Category:Pages using duplicate arguments in template calls -- ato (talk) 18:50, 28 August 2025 (UTC)Reply

was away for the we, will take care. I'm looking for missing }}? --Herzi Pinki (talk) 12:06, 31 August 2025 (UTC)Reply

after a lot of unsuccessful trials, I again need help: @Aafi: to

  • check my changes
  • commit my changes

I'm going with {{<tvar name="2x">Denkmalgeschütztes Objekt Österreich/Id|{{{1|}}}</tvar>|2=Id missing|3=needs migration to HERIS-ID}} in Template:Denkmalgeschütztes Objekt Österreich/i18n. The purpose is to have symmetric curly braces (I spent hours to find the cause of the asymmetry). The code in the language specific stuff than is: ... {{$2|2=Id missing!|3=migration to HERIS-ID needed}} ..., which should expand to {{Denkmalgeschütztes Objekt Österreich/Id|{{{1|}}}|2=Id missing!|3=migration to HERIS-ID needed}} - please check! If ok, please commit my changes. Sorry that I broke the code for the whole weekend. best --Herzi Pinki (talk) 18:29, 31 August 2025 (UTC)Reply

@Herzi Pinki, I can't seriously help in checking if the changes are right (I hardly have novice knowledege of templates) but if someone with good knowledge of templates says that it's okay to go, I will be glad to mark the page for translation. signed, Aafi (talk) 09:55, 1 September 2025 (UTC)Reply
@Mdaniels5757, would you probably help here? :) signed, Aafi (talk) 09:58, 1 September 2025 (UTC)Reply
@Aafi @Herzi Pinki Looks good to me, ✓ Done —‍Mdaniels5757 (talk • contribs) 15:18, 1 September 2025 (UTC)Reply
@Mdaniels5757: thanks a lot. Looks ok. best --Herzi Pinki (talk) 20:14, 1 September 2025 (UTC)Reply
translation to ar is missing, I get confused when I have open and closed stuff with rtl direction. --Herzi Pinki (talk) 20:16, 1 September 2025 (UTC)Reply

Sorry for not responding earlier (I didn’t have time when I got pinged, and then forgot about the ping). Unfortunately the chosen solution doesn’t work in all languages, for example it doesn’t work in my native language Hungarian.

The problem is that you split up the phrase with HERIS-ID 123456, ObjektID 12345 arbitrarily. The word with is the preposition of HERIS-ID and ObjektID – in English and German. However, other languages use other ways to express the grammatical connection, e.g. Hungarian uses agglutination (HERIS-ID-ja 123456, ObjektID-ja 12345) and Slavic languages like Slovak use inflection. Both of these would require changing the words HERIS-ID and ObjektID, which is impossible with the current setup. (Probably there are non-European languages that work yet differently, although I don’t have examples off the top of my head.)

A better solution would be:

Tacsipacsi (talk) 10:35, 8 November 2025 (UTC)Reply

@Herzi Pinki: FYI, if you haven't seen this yet. signed, Aafi (talk) 16:37, 8 November 2025 (UTC)Reply
thanks Aafi --Herzi Pinki (talk) 18:50, 8 November 2025 (UTC)Reply
  • the overall problem for me was that once the translation stuff has been applied to this template, it was really hard to modify the content of the template (except for minor text changes), especially without breaking anything and with so many transclusions. I just wanted to expand the functionality of my template and now I have to deal with the translation stuff.
  • the complexity arises from
  • the template does a legacy migration accepting old ObjektIDs and new WD-IDs as arguments as well, and has to differ correctly. No clear cut possible at the moment.
  • the values of the Ids shown in the template depend on existence of WD-properties.
  • generated links for supporting our workflows are created differently depending on parameter constellation.
  • Is there a way to develop your ideas Tacsipacsi in a copy of Template:Denkmalgeschütztes Objekt Österreich/i18n without the need to duplicate the whole template tree?
  • sorry, did not get your 3rd point, what are separate translation units; but the rest?
    • how do I switch between the three cases without duplicating the logic (now in Template:Denkmalgeschütztes Objekt Österreich/Id)?
    • is there really a need for HERIS-ID + ObjektID (and how?), or wouldn't it be possible to concat both (assuming that the comma as concatenation is ok in all languages, or have a separate translation unit for the concatenation string. How does concatenation work in rtl languages?). Otherwise I have to insert the ID values into that compound translation unit, don't know how (using {{Str rep}}?).
    • @separate translation units (like this in {{Denkmalgeschütztes Objekt Österreich/i18n}}?):
| lang = {{TRANSLATIONLANGUAGE}}
| 1    = {{{1|}}}
| 2    = <translate><!--T:2--> Upload more media to this category</translate>
| 3    = <translate><!--T:3--> Id missing</translate>
| 4    = <translate><!--T:4--> needs migration to HERIS-ID</translate>
| 5    = <translate><!--T:5--> HERIS-ID<!--this is the immutable literal name of an id, do not translate. You can add language specific inflection, prefix and/or suffix--></translate>
| 6    = <translate><!--T:6--> ObjektID<!--this is the immutable literal name of an id, do not translate. You can add language specific inflection, prefix and/or suffix--></translate>
| 7    = <translate><!--T:7--> HERIS-ID + ObjektID</translate> ?? or
| 7    = <translate><!--T:7--> HERIS-ID val1, ObjektID val2<!--do not change val1 and val2 strings!--></translate> ??
maybe it's better to make a clean rewrite from scratch, and apply the translation stuff again afterwards (by an expert). The current template seems to be bogus anyhow.
--Herzi Pinki (talk) 18:50, 8 November 2025 (UTC)Reply
@Herzi Pinki: I can only say what a separate translation unit means. In the case above, T2, T3, T4 and the rest are each a separate unit. Each string that you translate separately in the translation system is a different and separate unit. signed, Aafi (talk) 19:17, 8 November 2025 (UTC)Reply

Is there a way to develop your ideas Tacsipacsi in a copy of Template:Denkmalgeschütztes Objekt Österreich/i18n without the need to duplicate the whole template tree? I’m not sure what “duplicating the whole template tree” means, but I don’t think any page other than Template:Denkmalgeschütztes Objekt Österreich/i18n needs to be changed, so you could copy just that to a sandbox page.

how do I switch between the three cases without duplicating the logic (now in Template:Denkmalgeschütztes Objekt Österreich/Id)? A bit of duplication (one way or the other) is unavoidable, but most of the duplication can be avoided by simply not using Template:Denkmalgeschütztes Objekt Österreich/Id – with that, you don’t duplicate the logic, but simply move it.

is there really a need for HERIS-ID + ObjektID (and how?), or wouldn't it be possible to concat both (assuming that the comma as concatenation is ok in all languages, or have a separate translation unit for the concatenation string. How does concatenation work in rtl languages?). Exactly that’s the problem: concatenation works differently in different languages. Not only RTL languages, but also other languages, most notably Chinese and Japanese, which use a full-width comma (、) and no space after it. And even in languages that do use the same punctuation as English and German, “and” (or some variant) may read more naturally than a comma. Using three separate messages allows for more natural translation, at a relatively small cost (there are already two and a half branches, that’d increase to three).

Otherwise I have to insert the ID values into that compound translation unit, don't know how (using {{Str rep}}?). That’s what translation variables (<tvar>) are for.

I could change the interface of Template:Denkmalgeschütztes Objekt Österreich/Id to return a slash separated list of id-values I can strip using {{ParmPart}} / #titleparts. As I wrote, I think it’s best to just leave out that subtemplate.

can you provide a skeleton where I can then put my logic? Well, it turned out to be more of a complete solution than a skeleton. 🙂 

<languages />
<onlyinclude>{{Denkmalgeschütztes Objekt Österreich/layout
| text = {{tmpl
  |0=<translate><!--T:1--> This {{#if:{{#ifeq:{{NAMESPACE}}|{{ns:14}}|1}}|category|media}} shows the protected monument with $2 in Austria.</translate>
  |2={{#ifeq:{{Str left|{{{1|}}}|1}}|Q
    |{{#if:{{Data |item={{{1|}}} |property=P2951 |displayformat=raw}}
      |<translate>{{#if:{{Data |item={{{1|}}} |property=P9154 |displayformat=raw}}|HERIS-ID {{Data |item={{{1|}}} |property=P9154 |displayformat=raw}}|missing HERIS-ID}}, <small>ObjektID <span class="plainlinks">[https://denkmalliste.toolforge.org/index.php?action=EinzelID&ID={{Data |item={{{1|}}} |property=P2951 |displayformat=raw}} {{Data |item={{{1|}}} |property=P2951 |displayformat=raw}}]</span></small></translate>
      |<translate>{{#if:{{Data |item={{{1|}}} |property=P9154 |displayformat=raw}}|HERIS-ID {{Data |item={{{1|}}} |property=P9154 |displayformat=raw}}|missing HERIS-ID}}</translate>
      }}<!--

    legacy ObjektID: -->
    |{{#if:{{{1|}}}
      |<translate>ObjektID <span class="plainlinks">[https://denkmalliste.toolforge.org/index.php?action=EinzelID&ID={{{1}}} {{{1}}}]</span> <small>(needs migration to HERIS-ID)</small></translate>
      |<translate>missing ID</translate>
      }}
    }}
  }}
| lang = {{TRANSLATIONLANGUAGE}}
| 1    = {{{1|}}}
| 2    = <translate><!--T:2--> Upload more media to this category</translate>
}}</onlyinclude>
{{translated tag|marker}}

(I don’t see the <tvar>s in the rendered code for some reason, please copy the source code). I did some changes in addition to the translation markup:

  • Used missing ID / missing HERIS-ID instead of <Id missing!> – it reads more naturally, and avoids problems, should the translation happen to be a valid HTML/XML tag.
  • Used <small> instead of <span style="font-size:smaller"> to avoid overwhelming translators with syntax. I also think that <small> is semantically correct here. Moved the plainlinks class in the translation variable, so that translators don’t even see it (although I’m not sure if it’s needed at all; the old version didn’t use to have it).
  • Moved the “needs migration” message from a tooltip to a parenthesized note. This makes translation easier (no headaches with markup appearing in an HTML attribute), and avoids accessibility issues (tooltips are invisible on touchscreen devices such are smartphones).

The $2 in the main translation unit will appear on the translation interface as if it was a regular <tvar>, but {{Tmpl}} allows including more complex syntax.

Note that the translation interface shows message documentation (in the right column), what you wrote in HTML comments above should be added there (except for the comment about val1 and val2, which doesn’t need to be added anywhere ­– since they are translation variables, translators are expected to know how to handle them). —Tacsipacsi (talk) 12:59, 9 November 2025 (UTC)Reply

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